Can a wizard cast a spell during their first turn of combat if they initiated combat by releasing a readied...

Why doesn't UK go for the same deal Japan has with EU to resolve Brexit?

How to count occurrences of text in a file?

Domestic-to-international connection at Orlando (MCO)

Proper way to express "He disappeared them"

Won the lottery - how do I keep the money?

The exact meaning of 'Mom made me a sandwich'

Why didn't Khan get resurrected in the Genesis Explosion?

Would a grinding machine be a simple and workable propulsion system for an interplanetary spacecraft?

A Man With a Stainless Steel Endoskeleton (like The Terminator) Fighting Cloaked Aliens Only He Can See

Why don't programming languages automatically manage the synchronous/asynchronous problem?

Can we say or write : "No, it'sn't"?

The past simple of "gaslight" – "gaslighted" or "gaslit"?

How to invert MapIndexed on a ragged structure? How to construct a tree from rules?

Why do airplanes bank sharply to the right after air-to-air refueling?

Method for adding error messages to a dictionary given a key

How to install OpenCV on Raspbian Stretch?

Does increasing your ability score affect your main stat?

How I can get glyphs from a fraktur font and use them as identifiers?

Yu-Gi-Oh cards in Python 3

Why does standard notation not preserve intervals (visually)

Is a distribution that is normal, but highly skewed considered Gaussian?

Chain wire methods together in Lightning Web Components

Flying from Cape Town to England and return to another province

Bartok - Syncopation (1): Meaning of notes in between Grand Staff



Can a wizard cast a spell during their first turn of combat if they initiated combat by releasing a readied spell?



The Next CEO of Stack OverflowWhen and how does combat start in a standoff?Can players “Ready” outside of combat?How long can a readied spell be held before it's lost?Can a character drop a weapon in order to cast a spell that is a reaction?Can Dispel magic be used on a readied spell before the trigger occurs?Can a readied spell be Counterspelled after it is cast, but before the trigger occurs?What happens to the readied spell if you ignore all triggers?At what point does a caster define the target of a spell?Do you get your free interaction during a readied action?How specific does the Action for Ready need to be?Are there serious Balance Implications to permitting Bonus Actions to be Readied/Prepared?Can you Ready a Concentration spell?












23












$begingroup$


My wife plays a wizard. We hear Orcs coming up the hall. The wizard decides to ready a spell for when the door opens. So she casts the spell and holds it, until 10 seconds later, the door opens, initiating the trigger. Boom - the fireball goes off. Combat begins. Can she cast a spell on the first round of combat even though she released the energy of the readied spell as a triggered reaction?



My first inclination is, yes, because she didn't cast the spell at the beginning of combat, she did that when she readied the spell. She just released its energy as a reaction to the door opening, outlined on page 193.










share|improve this question











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to RPG.SE! Take the tour if you haven't already, and check out the help center for more guidance.
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:01






  • 7




    $begingroup$
    Related: Can players “Ready” outside of combat?
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:02










  • $begingroup$
    Where the Orcs aware of the presence of enemies beyond the door?
    $endgroup$
    – Ruse
    Mar 17 at 6:10








  • 3




    $begingroup$
    The Orcs knew we were somewhere in the keep, but not in that exact room, beyond that exact door.
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 17 at 20:23
















23












$begingroup$


My wife plays a wizard. We hear Orcs coming up the hall. The wizard decides to ready a spell for when the door opens. So she casts the spell and holds it, until 10 seconds later, the door opens, initiating the trigger. Boom - the fireball goes off. Combat begins. Can she cast a spell on the first round of combat even though she released the energy of the readied spell as a triggered reaction?



My first inclination is, yes, because she didn't cast the spell at the beginning of combat, she did that when she readied the spell. She just released its energy as a reaction to the door opening, outlined on page 193.










share|improve this question











$endgroup$












  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to RPG.SE! Take the tour if you haven't already, and check out the help center for more guidance.
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:01






  • 7




    $begingroup$
    Related: Can players “Ready” outside of combat?
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:02










  • $begingroup$
    Where the Orcs aware of the presence of enemies beyond the door?
    $endgroup$
    – Ruse
    Mar 17 at 6:10








  • 3




    $begingroup$
    The Orcs knew we were somewhere in the keep, but not in that exact room, beyond that exact door.
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 17 at 20:23














23












23








23


2



$begingroup$


My wife plays a wizard. We hear Orcs coming up the hall. The wizard decides to ready a spell for when the door opens. So she casts the spell and holds it, until 10 seconds later, the door opens, initiating the trigger. Boom - the fireball goes off. Combat begins. Can she cast a spell on the first round of combat even though she released the energy of the readied spell as a triggered reaction?



My first inclination is, yes, because she didn't cast the spell at the beginning of combat, she did that when she readied the spell. She just released its energy as a reaction to the door opening, outlined on page 193.










share|improve this question











$endgroup$




My wife plays a wizard. We hear Orcs coming up the hall. The wizard decides to ready a spell for when the door opens. So she casts the spell and holds it, until 10 seconds later, the door opens, initiating the trigger. Boom - the fireball goes off. Combat begins. Can she cast a spell on the first round of combat even though she released the energy of the readied spell as a triggered reaction?



My first inclination is, yes, because she didn't cast the spell at the beginning of combat, she did that when she readied the spell. She just released its energy as a reaction to the door opening, outlined on page 193.







dnd-5e spells initiative readied-action






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited Mar 17 at 7:49









V2Blast

26k588158




26k588158










asked Mar 17 at 4:56









BryanBryan

1185




1185












  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to RPG.SE! Take the tour if you haven't already, and check out the help center for more guidance.
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:01






  • 7




    $begingroup$
    Related: Can players “Ready” outside of combat?
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:02










  • $begingroup$
    Where the Orcs aware of the presence of enemies beyond the door?
    $endgroup$
    – Ruse
    Mar 17 at 6:10








  • 3




    $begingroup$
    The Orcs knew we were somewhere in the keep, but not in that exact room, beyond that exact door.
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 17 at 20:23


















  • $begingroup$
    Welcome to RPG.SE! Take the tour if you haven't already, and check out the help center for more guidance.
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:01






  • 7




    $begingroup$
    Related: Can players “Ready” outside of combat?
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 6:02










  • $begingroup$
    Where the Orcs aware of the presence of enemies beyond the door?
    $endgroup$
    – Ruse
    Mar 17 at 6:10








  • 3




    $begingroup$
    The Orcs knew we were somewhere in the keep, but not in that exact room, beyond that exact door.
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 17 at 20:23
















$begingroup$
Welcome to RPG.SE! Take the tour if you haven't already, and check out the help center for more guidance.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
Mar 17 at 6:01




$begingroup$
Welcome to RPG.SE! Take the tour if you haven't already, and check out the help center for more guidance.
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
Mar 17 at 6:01




7




7




$begingroup$
Related: Can players “Ready” outside of combat?
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
Mar 17 at 6:02




$begingroup$
Related: Can players “Ready” outside of combat?
$endgroup$
– V2Blast
Mar 17 at 6:02












$begingroup$
Where the Orcs aware of the presence of enemies beyond the door?
$endgroup$
– Ruse
Mar 17 at 6:10






$begingroup$
Where the Orcs aware of the presence of enemies beyond the door?
$endgroup$
– Ruse
Mar 17 at 6:10






3




3




$begingroup$
The Orcs knew we were somewhere in the keep, but not in that exact room, beyond that exact door.
$endgroup$
– Bryan
Mar 17 at 20:23




$begingroup$
The Orcs knew we were somewhere in the keep, but not in that exact room, beyond that exact door.
$endgroup$
– Bryan
Mar 17 at 20:23










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















30












$begingroup$

The wizard can't Ready a spell before combat begins



The wizard can cast spells during her first round, but she can't release a readied spell before her first round because she can't Ready a spell before combat begins.



As Jeremy Crawford clarified:




The options, including Ready, in the "Actions in Combat" section (PH, 192–93) are meant to be used in combat, after rolling initiative.




This isn't just an arbitrary restriction; it is a rule meant to streamline play. To see why, lets look at the first step in every combat, Surprise:




The GM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. [...] Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.



If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends.




If the Orcs are surprised, they effectively waste their first turn and the wizard still gets to cast her fireball before the Orcs have a chance to do anything. Basically, the game simulates ambushes with the Surprise, not with Ready actions.



If the Orcs are not surprised, then you basically have a standoff that hinges (pun intended) around that door. The Wizard wants to Ready an action and so do the Orcs, but if everyone is going to ready an action for when the door opens, what's the point? Just play through the first round of combat when the door opens.



As explained in Order of Combat:




The game organizes the chaos of combat into a cycle of rounds and turns.




If you allow combats to begin with a bunch of reactions, you effectively reintroduce that chaos for no reason. For example, initiative tells you which turn occurs first, but if combat begins with reactions, whose reaction occurs first?





A readied spell and the spell slot used to cast it are wasted after 6 seconds



This isn't immediately obvious, but it's the result of several rules.



From Order of Combat:




A round represents about 6 seconds in the game world. During a round, each participant in a battle takes a turn.




From Ready:




you can take the Ready action on your turn, which lets you act using your reaction before the start of your next turn.







When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs.




From Spell Slots:




When a character casts a spell, he or she expends a slot of that spell's level or higher




Basically, when you Ready a spell, you cast it and expend a spell slot, but you can only release the readied spell before your next turn and the time between turns is 6 seconds.






share|improve this answer











$endgroup$













  • $begingroup$
    You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 9:36










  • $begingroup$
    Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 18 at 1:06






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
    $endgroup$
    – Exal
    Mar 18 at 9:48






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
    $endgroup$
    – Glen O
    Mar 18 at 12:45










  • $begingroup$
    When does combat start?
    $endgroup$
    – András
    Mar 18 at 20:12



















29












$begingroup$

No. Readying actions is not how you should handle an ambush.



It is a mistake for the DM to allow players to spend actions (by readying an action to use later) before combat has started. Until you roll for initiative, gameplay isn't broken up into actions in that way.



Instead, the DM should rule that the Orcs are surprised by the players, who have set up an ambush for whoever opens the door. The rules for surprise are written on Page 72 of the Basic Rules and page 189 of the Player's Handbook:




The DM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to
be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM
compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the
passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing
side. Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is
surprised at the start of the encounter.



If you’re surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the
combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can
be surprised even if the other members aren't.




In practice using the regular surprise rules will work out much like allowing the PCs to ready actions before the combat starts. The wizard could cast a fireball on the turn the Orcs spend being surprised, and then another one one the next turn, as the Orcs start to fight. If they roll well enough on initiative, they might get both spells off before the Orcs can do anything at all.



If it makes sense given the situation (or just seems more fun), the DM could probably allow the players to have surprised the Orcs without requiring any Stealth checks. But beware if you're a player and you ask for that, as it might give the DM license to have monsters ambush your party as you go through some future doorway, without allowing you a Perception check either!






share|improve this answer











$endgroup$





















    5












    $begingroup$

    Yes to the title question — everything you say about the limits on spellcasting is correct.



    The only restriction on casting multiple spells on the same turn comes in when you cast a spell as a bonus action. Your reaction is not a bonus action.



    Some people might have concern with how your group is running readied actions. Technically, you can only ready an action within combat rounds, and the ready "expires" the next round — so you can't hold it arbitrarily until the door opens.



    Another way to do this: ask for stealth rolls from the party. If those rolls beat the passive perception of the orcs, the orcs will be surprised when they come through the door — which means they don't act on the first round, while the party pelts them with fireballs and whatever else.



    In practice, though, I've seen many, many 5E DMs allow sitting-in-wait readied actions (including "I'll hit them with this spell, when X happens"). It has never once hampered my experience of the game and generally flows quickly, smoothly, and naturally. So, there is no harm in running it like this, and it seems like a perfectly reasonable way to model "I'm waiting to fireball whatever comes through that door". However, if multiple players want to ready actions, or orcs have something complicated planned, better to switch to the surprise paradigm.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$









    • 1




      $begingroup$
      I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
      $endgroup$
      – SeriousBri
      Mar 18 at 9:25












    Your Answer





    StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
    return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
    StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
    StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["\$", "\$"]]);
    });
    });
    }, "mathjax-editing");

    StackExchange.ready(function() {
    var channelOptions = {
    tags: "".split(" "),
    id: "122"
    };
    initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

    StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
    // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
    if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
    StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
    createEditor();
    });
    }
    else {
    createEditor();
    }
    });

    function createEditor() {
    StackExchange.prepareEditor({
    heartbeatType: 'answer',
    autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
    convertImagesToLinks: false,
    noModals: true,
    showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
    reputationToPostImages: null,
    bindNavPrevention: true,
    postfix: "",
    imageUploader: {
    brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
    contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
    allowUrls: true
    },
    noCode: true, onDemand: true,
    discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
    ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
    });


    }
    });














    draft saved

    draft discarded


















    StackExchange.ready(
    function () {
    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2frpg.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f143312%2fcan-a-wizard-cast-a-spell-during-their-first-turn-of-combat-if-they-initiated-co%23new-answer', 'question_page');
    }
    );

    Post as a guest















    Required, but never shown

























    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes








    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    30












    $begingroup$

    The wizard can't Ready a spell before combat begins



    The wizard can cast spells during her first round, but she can't release a readied spell before her first round because she can't Ready a spell before combat begins.



    As Jeremy Crawford clarified:




    The options, including Ready, in the "Actions in Combat" section (PH, 192–93) are meant to be used in combat, after rolling initiative.




    This isn't just an arbitrary restriction; it is a rule meant to streamline play. To see why, lets look at the first step in every combat, Surprise:




    The GM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. [...] Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.



    If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends.




    If the Orcs are surprised, they effectively waste their first turn and the wizard still gets to cast her fireball before the Orcs have a chance to do anything. Basically, the game simulates ambushes with the Surprise, not with Ready actions.



    If the Orcs are not surprised, then you basically have a standoff that hinges (pun intended) around that door. The Wizard wants to Ready an action and so do the Orcs, but if everyone is going to ready an action for when the door opens, what's the point? Just play through the first round of combat when the door opens.



    As explained in Order of Combat:




    The game organizes the chaos of combat into a cycle of rounds and turns.




    If you allow combats to begin with a bunch of reactions, you effectively reintroduce that chaos for no reason. For example, initiative tells you which turn occurs first, but if combat begins with reactions, whose reaction occurs first?





    A readied spell and the spell slot used to cast it are wasted after 6 seconds



    This isn't immediately obvious, but it's the result of several rules.



    From Order of Combat:




    A round represents about 6 seconds in the game world. During a round, each participant in a battle takes a turn.




    From Ready:




    you can take the Ready action on your turn, which lets you act using your reaction before the start of your next turn.







    When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs.




    From Spell Slots:




    When a character casts a spell, he or she expends a slot of that spell's level or higher




    Basically, when you Ready a spell, you cast it and expend a spell slot, but you can only release the readied spell before your next turn and the time between turns is 6 seconds.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$













    • $begingroup$
      You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
      $endgroup$
      – V2Blast
      Mar 17 at 9:36










    • $begingroup$
      Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
      $endgroup$
      – Bryan
      Mar 18 at 1:06






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
      $endgroup$
      – Exal
      Mar 18 at 9:48






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
      $endgroup$
      – Glen O
      Mar 18 at 12:45










    • $begingroup$
      When does combat start?
      $endgroup$
      – András
      Mar 18 at 20:12
















    30












    $begingroup$

    The wizard can't Ready a spell before combat begins



    The wizard can cast spells during her first round, but she can't release a readied spell before her first round because she can't Ready a spell before combat begins.



    As Jeremy Crawford clarified:




    The options, including Ready, in the "Actions in Combat" section (PH, 192–93) are meant to be used in combat, after rolling initiative.




    This isn't just an arbitrary restriction; it is a rule meant to streamline play. To see why, lets look at the first step in every combat, Surprise:




    The GM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. [...] Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.



    If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends.




    If the Orcs are surprised, they effectively waste their first turn and the wizard still gets to cast her fireball before the Orcs have a chance to do anything. Basically, the game simulates ambushes with the Surprise, not with Ready actions.



    If the Orcs are not surprised, then you basically have a standoff that hinges (pun intended) around that door. The Wizard wants to Ready an action and so do the Orcs, but if everyone is going to ready an action for when the door opens, what's the point? Just play through the first round of combat when the door opens.



    As explained in Order of Combat:




    The game organizes the chaos of combat into a cycle of rounds and turns.




    If you allow combats to begin with a bunch of reactions, you effectively reintroduce that chaos for no reason. For example, initiative tells you which turn occurs first, but if combat begins with reactions, whose reaction occurs first?





    A readied spell and the spell slot used to cast it are wasted after 6 seconds



    This isn't immediately obvious, but it's the result of several rules.



    From Order of Combat:




    A round represents about 6 seconds in the game world. During a round, each participant in a battle takes a turn.




    From Ready:




    you can take the Ready action on your turn, which lets you act using your reaction before the start of your next turn.







    When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs.




    From Spell Slots:




    When a character casts a spell, he or she expends a slot of that spell's level or higher




    Basically, when you Ready a spell, you cast it and expend a spell slot, but you can only release the readied spell before your next turn and the time between turns is 6 seconds.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$













    • $begingroup$
      You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
      $endgroup$
      – V2Blast
      Mar 17 at 9:36










    • $begingroup$
      Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
      $endgroup$
      – Bryan
      Mar 18 at 1:06






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
      $endgroup$
      – Exal
      Mar 18 at 9:48






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
      $endgroup$
      – Glen O
      Mar 18 at 12:45










    • $begingroup$
      When does combat start?
      $endgroup$
      – András
      Mar 18 at 20:12














    30












    30








    30





    $begingroup$

    The wizard can't Ready a spell before combat begins



    The wizard can cast spells during her first round, but she can't release a readied spell before her first round because she can't Ready a spell before combat begins.



    As Jeremy Crawford clarified:




    The options, including Ready, in the "Actions in Combat" section (PH, 192–93) are meant to be used in combat, after rolling initiative.




    This isn't just an arbitrary restriction; it is a rule meant to streamline play. To see why, lets look at the first step in every combat, Surprise:




    The GM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. [...] Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.



    If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends.




    If the Orcs are surprised, they effectively waste their first turn and the wizard still gets to cast her fireball before the Orcs have a chance to do anything. Basically, the game simulates ambushes with the Surprise, not with Ready actions.



    If the Orcs are not surprised, then you basically have a standoff that hinges (pun intended) around that door. The Wizard wants to Ready an action and so do the Orcs, but if everyone is going to ready an action for when the door opens, what's the point? Just play through the first round of combat when the door opens.



    As explained in Order of Combat:




    The game organizes the chaos of combat into a cycle of rounds and turns.




    If you allow combats to begin with a bunch of reactions, you effectively reintroduce that chaos for no reason. For example, initiative tells you which turn occurs first, but if combat begins with reactions, whose reaction occurs first?





    A readied spell and the spell slot used to cast it are wasted after 6 seconds



    This isn't immediately obvious, but it's the result of several rules.



    From Order of Combat:




    A round represents about 6 seconds in the game world. During a round, each participant in a battle takes a turn.




    From Ready:




    you can take the Ready action on your turn, which lets you act using your reaction before the start of your next turn.







    When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs.




    From Spell Slots:




    When a character casts a spell, he or she expends a slot of that spell's level or higher




    Basically, when you Ready a spell, you cast it and expend a spell slot, but you can only release the readied spell before your next turn and the time between turns is 6 seconds.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$



    The wizard can't Ready a spell before combat begins



    The wizard can cast spells during her first round, but she can't release a readied spell before her first round because she can't Ready a spell before combat begins.



    As Jeremy Crawford clarified:




    The options, including Ready, in the "Actions in Combat" section (PH, 192–93) are meant to be used in combat, after rolling initiative.




    This isn't just an arbitrary restriction; it is a rule meant to streamline play. To see why, lets look at the first step in every combat, Surprise:




    The GM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. [...] Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.



    If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends.




    If the Orcs are surprised, they effectively waste their first turn and the wizard still gets to cast her fireball before the Orcs have a chance to do anything. Basically, the game simulates ambushes with the Surprise, not with Ready actions.



    If the Orcs are not surprised, then you basically have a standoff that hinges (pun intended) around that door. The Wizard wants to Ready an action and so do the Orcs, but if everyone is going to ready an action for when the door opens, what's the point? Just play through the first round of combat when the door opens.



    As explained in Order of Combat:




    The game organizes the chaos of combat into a cycle of rounds and turns.




    If you allow combats to begin with a bunch of reactions, you effectively reintroduce that chaos for no reason. For example, initiative tells you which turn occurs first, but if combat begins with reactions, whose reaction occurs first?





    A readied spell and the spell slot used to cast it are wasted after 6 seconds



    This isn't immediately obvious, but it's the result of several rules.



    From Order of Combat:




    A round represents about 6 seconds in the game world. During a round, each participant in a battle takes a turn.




    From Ready:




    you can take the Ready action on your turn, which lets you act using your reaction before the start of your next turn.







    When you ready a spell, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs.




    From Spell Slots:




    When a character casts a spell, he or she expends a slot of that spell's level or higher




    Basically, when you Ready a spell, you cast it and expend a spell slot, but you can only release the readied spell before your next turn and the time between turns is 6 seconds.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited Mar 17 at 10:07









    V2Blast

    26k588158




    26k588158










    answered Mar 17 at 7:08









    RuseRuse

    6,89411558




    6,89411558












    • $begingroup$
      You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
      $endgroup$
      – V2Blast
      Mar 17 at 9:36










    • $begingroup$
      Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
      $endgroup$
      – Bryan
      Mar 18 at 1:06






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
      $endgroup$
      – Exal
      Mar 18 at 9:48






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
      $endgroup$
      – Glen O
      Mar 18 at 12:45










    • $begingroup$
      When does combat start?
      $endgroup$
      – András
      Mar 18 at 20:12


















    • $begingroup$
      You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
      $endgroup$
      – V2Blast
      Mar 17 at 9:36










    • $begingroup$
      Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
      $endgroup$
      – Bryan
      Mar 18 at 1:06






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
      $endgroup$
      – Exal
      Mar 18 at 9:48






    • 2




      $begingroup$
      Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
      $endgroup$
      – Glen O
      Mar 18 at 12:45










    • $begingroup$
      When does combat start?
      $endgroup$
      – András
      Mar 18 at 20:12
















    $begingroup$
    You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 9:36




    $begingroup$
    You should reference the sources of your rules quotes (e.g. page numbers, or basic rules links).
    $endgroup$
    – V2Blast
    Mar 17 at 9:36












    $begingroup$
    Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 18 at 1:06




    $begingroup$
    Highlighting the "before the start of your next turn" was quite a help to my understanding of READY. I overlooked this important element of ready. Also, I have benefited by your explanation of combat actions vs role playing an ambush to surprise the enemy. Great answer!!
    $endgroup$
    – Bryan
    Mar 18 at 1:06




    2




    2




    $begingroup$
    This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
    $endgroup$
    – Exal
    Mar 18 at 9:48




    $begingroup$
    This is everything I needed to know about Readying but was afraid to ask. And it means I did two combat encounters last week wrong, heheh.
    $endgroup$
    – Exal
    Mar 18 at 9:48




    2




    2




    $begingroup$
    Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
    $endgroup$
    – Glen O
    Mar 18 at 12:45




    $begingroup$
    Regarding the second part of your answer, it's worth noting that Jeremy Crawford himself said (in the first link you provided) he would allow a character in a game he's DMing to use their action to "hold the readied spell", allowing the readied spell to be maintained without needing more spell slots. It's not official, but what you might call an "official house rule".
    $endgroup$
    – Glen O
    Mar 18 at 12:45












    $begingroup$
    When does combat start?
    $endgroup$
    – András
    Mar 18 at 20:12




    $begingroup$
    When does combat start?
    $endgroup$
    – András
    Mar 18 at 20:12













    29












    $begingroup$

    No. Readying actions is not how you should handle an ambush.



    It is a mistake for the DM to allow players to spend actions (by readying an action to use later) before combat has started. Until you roll for initiative, gameplay isn't broken up into actions in that way.



    Instead, the DM should rule that the Orcs are surprised by the players, who have set up an ambush for whoever opens the door. The rules for surprise are written on Page 72 of the Basic Rules and page 189 of the Player's Handbook:




    The DM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to
    be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM
    compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the
    passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing
    side. Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is
    surprised at the start of the encounter.



    If you’re surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the
    combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can
    be surprised even if the other members aren't.




    In practice using the regular surprise rules will work out much like allowing the PCs to ready actions before the combat starts. The wizard could cast a fireball on the turn the Orcs spend being surprised, and then another one one the next turn, as the Orcs start to fight. If they roll well enough on initiative, they might get both spells off before the Orcs can do anything at all.



    If it makes sense given the situation (or just seems more fun), the DM could probably allow the players to have surprised the Orcs without requiring any Stealth checks. But beware if you're a player and you ask for that, as it might give the DM license to have monsters ambush your party as you go through some future doorway, without allowing you a Perception check either!






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$


















      29












      $begingroup$

      No. Readying actions is not how you should handle an ambush.



      It is a mistake for the DM to allow players to spend actions (by readying an action to use later) before combat has started. Until you roll for initiative, gameplay isn't broken up into actions in that way.



      Instead, the DM should rule that the Orcs are surprised by the players, who have set up an ambush for whoever opens the door. The rules for surprise are written on Page 72 of the Basic Rules and page 189 of the Player's Handbook:




      The DM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to
      be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM
      compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the
      passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing
      side. Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is
      surprised at the start of the encounter.



      If you’re surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the
      combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can
      be surprised even if the other members aren't.




      In practice using the regular surprise rules will work out much like allowing the PCs to ready actions before the combat starts. The wizard could cast a fireball on the turn the Orcs spend being surprised, and then another one one the next turn, as the Orcs start to fight. If they roll well enough on initiative, they might get both spells off before the Orcs can do anything at all.



      If it makes sense given the situation (or just seems more fun), the DM could probably allow the players to have surprised the Orcs without requiring any Stealth checks. But beware if you're a player and you ask for that, as it might give the DM license to have monsters ambush your party as you go through some future doorway, without allowing you a Perception check either!






      share|improve this answer











      $endgroup$
















        29












        29








        29





        $begingroup$

        No. Readying actions is not how you should handle an ambush.



        It is a mistake for the DM to allow players to spend actions (by readying an action to use later) before combat has started. Until you roll for initiative, gameplay isn't broken up into actions in that way.



        Instead, the DM should rule that the Orcs are surprised by the players, who have set up an ambush for whoever opens the door. The rules for surprise are written on Page 72 of the Basic Rules and page 189 of the Player's Handbook:




        The DM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to
        be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM
        compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the
        passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing
        side. Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is
        surprised at the start of the encounter.



        If you’re surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the
        combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can
        be surprised even if the other members aren't.




        In practice using the regular surprise rules will work out much like allowing the PCs to ready actions before the combat starts. The wizard could cast a fireball on the turn the Orcs spend being surprised, and then another one one the next turn, as the Orcs start to fight. If they roll well enough on initiative, they might get both spells off before the Orcs can do anything at all.



        If it makes sense given the situation (or just seems more fun), the DM could probably allow the players to have surprised the Orcs without requiring any Stealth checks. But beware if you're a player and you ask for that, as it might give the DM license to have monsters ambush your party as you go through some future doorway, without allowing you a Perception check either!






        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$



        No. Readying actions is not how you should handle an ambush.



        It is a mistake for the DM to allow players to spend actions (by readying an action to use later) before combat has started. Until you roll for initiative, gameplay isn't broken up into actions in that way.



        Instead, the DM should rule that the Orcs are surprised by the players, who have set up an ambush for whoever opens the door. The rules for surprise are written on Page 72 of the Basic Rules and page 189 of the Player's Handbook:




        The DM determines who might be surprised. If neither side tries to
        be stealthy, they automatically notice each other. Otherwise, the DM
        compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the
        passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing
        side. Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat is
        surprised at the start of the encounter.



        If you’re surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the
        combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can
        be surprised even if the other members aren't.




        In practice using the regular surprise rules will work out much like allowing the PCs to ready actions before the combat starts. The wizard could cast a fireball on the turn the Orcs spend being surprised, and then another one one the next turn, as the Orcs start to fight. If they roll well enough on initiative, they might get both spells off before the Orcs can do anything at all.



        If it makes sense given the situation (or just seems more fun), the DM could probably allow the players to have surprised the Orcs without requiring any Stealth checks. But beware if you're a player and you ask for that, as it might give the DM license to have monsters ambush your party as you go through some future doorway, without allowing you a Perception check either!







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited Mar 17 at 6:47









        V2Blast

        26k588158




        26k588158










        answered Mar 17 at 6:29









        BlckknghtBlckknght

        766610




        766610























            5












            $begingroup$

            Yes to the title question — everything you say about the limits on spellcasting is correct.



            The only restriction on casting multiple spells on the same turn comes in when you cast a spell as a bonus action. Your reaction is not a bonus action.



            Some people might have concern with how your group is running readied actions. Technically, you can only ready an action within combat rounds, and the ready "expires" the next round — so you can't hold it arbitrarily until the door opens.



            Another way to do this: ask for stealth rolls from the party. If those rolls beat the passive perception of the orcs, the orcs will be surprised when they come through the door — which means they don't act on the first round, while the party pelts them with fireballs and whatever else.



            In practice, though, I've seen many, many 5E DMs allow sitting-in-wait readied actions (including "I'll hit them with this spell, when X happens"). It has never once hampered my experience of the game and generally flows quickly, smoothly, and naturally. So, there is no harm in running it like this, and it seems like a perfectly reasonable way to model "I'm waiting to fireball whatever comes through that door". However, if multiple players want to ready actions, or orcs have something complicated planned, better to switch to the surprise paradigm.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$









            • 1




              $begingroup$
              I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
              $endgroup$
              – SeriousBri
              Mar 18 at 9:25
















            5












            $begingroup$

            Yes to the title question — everything you say about the limits on spellcasting is correct.



            The only restriction on casting multiple spells on the same turn comes in when you cast a spell as a bonus action. Your reaction is not a bonus action.



            Some people might have concern with how your group is running readied actions. Technically, you can only ready an action within combat rounds, and the ready "expires" the next round — so you can't hold it arbitrarily until the door opens.



            Another way to do this: ask for stealth rolls from the party. If those rolls beat the passive perception of the orcs, the orcs will be surprised when they come through the door — which means they don't act on the first round, while the party pelts them with fireballs and whatever else.



            In practice, though, I've seen many, many 5E DMs allow sitting-in-wait readied actions (including "I'll hit them with this spell, when X happens"). It has never once hampered my experience of the game and generally flows quickly, smoothly, and naturally. So, there is no harm in running it like this, and it seems like a perfectly reasonable way to model "I'm waiting to fireball whatever comes through that door". However, if multiple players want to ready actions, or orcs have something complicated planned, better to switch to the surprise paradigm.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$









            • 1




              $begingroup$
              I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
              $endgroup$
              – SeriousBri
              Mar 18 at 9:25














            5












            5








            5





            $begingroup$

            Yes to the title question — everything you say about the limits on spellcasting is correct.



            The only restriction on casting multiple spells on the same turn comes in when you cast a spell as a bonus action. Your reaction is not a bonus action.



            Some people might have concern with how your group is running readied actions. Technically, you can only ready an action within combat rounds, and the ready "expires" the next round — so you can't hold it arbitrarily until the door opens.



            Another way to do this: ask for stealth rolls from the party. If those rolls beat the passive perception of the orcs, the orcs will be surprised when they come through the door — which means they don't act on the first round, while the party pelts them with fireballs and whatever else.



            In practice, though, I've seen many, many 5E DMs allow sitting-in-wait readied actions (including "I'll hit them with this spell, when X happens"). It has never once hampered my experience of the game and generally flows quickly, smoothly, and naturally. So, there is no harm in running it like this, and it seems like a perfectly reasonable way to model "I'm waiting to fireball whatever comes through that door". However, if multiple players want to ready actions, or orcs have something complicated planned, better to switch to the surprise paradigm.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$



            Yes to the title question — everything you say about the limits on spellcasting is correct.



            The only restriction on casting multiple spells on the same turn comes in when you cast a spell as a bonus action. Your reaction is not a bonus action.



            Some people might have concern with how your group is running readied actions. Technically, you can only ready an action within combat rounds, and the ready "expires" the next round — so you can't hold it arbitrarily until the door opens.



            Another way to do this: ask for stealth rolls from the party. If those rolls beat the passive perception of the orcs, the orcs will be surprised when they come through the door — which means they don't act on the first round, while the party pelts them with fireballs and whatever else.



            In practice, though, I've seen many, many 5E DMs allow sitting-in-wait readied actions (including "I'll hit them with this spell, when X happens"). It has never once hampered my experience of the game and generally flows quickly, smoothly, and naturally. So, there is no harm in running it like this, and it seems like a perfectly reasonable way to model "I'm waiting to fireball whatever comes through that door". However, if multiple players want to ready actions, or orcs have something complicated planned, better to switch to the surprise paradigm.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited Mar 18 at 1:02

























            answered Mar 17 at 5:25









            mattdmmattdm

            17.1k879128




            17.1k879128








            • 1




              $begingroup$
              I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
              $endgroup$
              – SeriousBri
              Mar 18 at 9:25














            • 1




              $begingroup$
              I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
              $endgroup$
              – SeriousBri
              Mar 18 at 9:25








            1




            1




            $begingroup$
            I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
            $endgroup$
            – SeriousBri
            Mar 18 at 9:25




            $begingroup$
            I like that this answer concentrates on actually allowing what is proposed and not just explaining that it is the wrong thing to do, the only thing I would add is this effectively gives a limited surprise round, so is actually to the detriment of the party lying in ambush - as long as it is the same ruling for when the NPC's make an ambush then it evens out.
            $endgroup$
            – SeriousBri
            Mar 18 at 9:25


















            draft saved

            draft discarded




















































            Thanks for contributing an answer to Role-playing Games Stack Exchange!


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid



            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


            Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




            draft saved


            draft discarded














            StackExchange.ready(
            function () {
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2frpg.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f143312%2fcan-a-wizard-cast-a-spell-during-their-first-turn-of-combat-if-they-initiated-co%23new-answer', 'question_page');
            }
            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown





















































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown

































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown







            Popular posts from this blog

            Magento 2 - Add success message with knockout Planned maintenance scheduled April 23, 2019 at 23:30 UTC (7:30pm US/Eastern) Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Unicorn Meta Zoo #1: Why another podcast?Success / Error message on ajax request$.widget is not a function when loading a homepage after add custom jQuery on custom themeHow can bind jQuery to current document in Magento 2 When template load by ajaxRedirect page using plugin in Magento 2Magento 2 - Update quantity and totals of cart page without page reload?Magento 2: Quote data not loaded on knockout checkoutMagento 2 : I need to change add to cart success message after adding product into cart through pluginMagento 2.2.5 How to add additional products to cart from new checkout step?Magento 2 Add error/success message with knockoutCan't validate Post Code on checkout page

            Fil:Tokke komm.svg

            Where did Arya get these scars? Unicorn Meta Zoo #1: Why another podcast? Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Favourite questions and answers from the 1st quarter of 2019Why did Arya refuse to end it?Has the pronunciation of Arya Stark's name changed?Has Arya forgiven people?Why did Arya Stark lose her vision?Why can Arya still use the faces?Has the Narrow Sea become narrower?Does Arya Stark know how to make poisons outside of the House of Black and White?Why did Nymeria leave Arya?Why did Arya not kill the Lannister soldiers she encountered in the Riverlands?What is the current canonical age of Sansa, Bran and Arya Stark?